- PowerScore Staff
- Posts: 9010
- Joined: Feb 02, 2011
- Fri May 01, 2020 10:00 am
#75153
Below is a conversation between PowerScore CEO Dave Killoran and a student, Nn, regarding Nn's law school choice.
Nn: "Reading through this forum has been very helpful! I’m in a similar boat to many, but unfortunately due to Covid (and being out of the country for the months before), I was unable to do any visits. I had planned on a gap year teaching abroad but the program was cancelled so I am now
planning to attend school. I had applied just in case, all over the board. I got into GW, Vanderbilt and Boston with less than a 1/3. I got full tuition at Iowa, Temple, Maryland, GMU and Denver. I’m considering the full tuition offers more heavily, as I’m very hesitant about everything right now and am not sure what area I want to practice in. I’ve always wanted to be on the east coast, any thoughts?"
Dave Killoran: "Hi Nn,
Thanks for the message! Any chance you could run down the COA (cost of attendance) for me? It’s basically impossible to make an informed call without knowing your exact debt outcomes here and whether you have any living arrangements that make one school cheaper than another (even with full rides)!"
Thanks!"
Nn: "Sure. Thanks for the reply. I just used the schools housing/cost estimates. GW COA after scholarship is $210,000. Vanderbilt and BU COA is about $214,000. Based on schools estimates my COA at Temple would be $60,000 (high estimate accounting for 20k per year for housing/books/travel /misc). Maryland COA would be $80,000. Denver COA is $60,000. I think I’ve ruled out Iowa for location (want to work in a major city) and GMU based on feel. I’m not tied to any specific field yet but have an interest in international law and hopes to work in a large city (Philadelphia, DC, Chicago…)"
Dave Killoran: "Hi Nn,
So with that info, let’s group those choices again and see how they compete internally:
First group: T25 (comparison: https://www.lstreports.com/compare/vanderbilt/bu/gw/)
#18 Vanderbilt COA is $214,000.
#20 BU COA is $214,000.
#23 GW COA is $210,000.
These schools are all the same price, and of the three the hiring numbers at Vandy–as well as the national recognition–are highest. Vandy has the best biglaw placement and a much higher federal clerkship placement rate (and both are a reflection of name brand power). Other than geographical/city preferences (and Nashville is awesome), Vandy would be the clear choice of these three given costs are identical.
Second group: T75 (comparison: https://www.lstreports.com/compare/mary ... le/denver/)
#47 Maryland COA is $80,000.
#56 Temple COA is $60,000.
#74 Denver COA is $60,000.
Of those three, Temple has slightly better numbers than Maryland (likely due to Temple’s location in Philly), and both have better placement than Denver. I’d likely lean toward Temple since it’s $20K cheaper, but an argument can be made for Maryland too. I don’t see how Denver competes with Temple as far as employment.
So, if it were me, it’s Temple vs Vandy (https://www.lstreports.com/compare/vanderbilt/temple/), and what happens next depends entirely on your career aspirations. If it’s a biglaw career then Vandy is clearly superior and may well be worth the extra $150K. But if you prefer maximum lifetime flexibility–but without nearly the access to high-profile/high-paying jobs–then Temple could easily be safer for you. And it’s on the East Coast
However, right now you don’t seem too sure about what you want to do so you should really think on this since it’s a huge financial decision either way you go!
I hope that helps, thanks!"
Nn: "Reading through this forum has been very helpful! I’m in a similar boat to many, but unfortunately due to Covid (and being out of the country for the months before), I was unable to do any visits. I had planned on a gap year teaching abroad but the program was cancelled so I am now
planning to attend school. I had applied just in case, all over the board. I got into GW, Vanderbilt and Boston with less than a 1/3. I got full tuition at Iowa, Temple, Maryland, GMU and Denver. I’m considering the full tuition offers more heavily, as I’m very hesitant about everything right now and am not sure what area I want to practice in. I’ve always wanted to be on the east coast, any thoughts?"
Dave Killoran: "Hi Nn,
Thanks for the message! Any chance you could run down the COA (cost of attendance) for me? It’s basically impossible to make an informed call without knowing your exact debt outcomes here and whether you have any living arrangements that make one school cheaper than another (even with full rides)!"
Thanks!"
Nn: "Sure. Thanks for the reply. I just used the schools housing/cost estimates. GW COA after scholarship is $210,000. Vanderbilt and BU COA is about $214,000. Based on schools estimates my COA at Temple would be $60,000 (high estimate accounting for 20k per year for housing/books/travel /misc). Maryland COA would be $80,000. Denver COA is $60,000. I think I’ve ruled out Iowa for location (want to work in a major city) and GMU based on feel. I’m not tied to any specific field yet but have an interest in international law and hopes to work in a large city (Philadelphia, DC, Chicago…)"
Dave Killoran: "Hi Nn,
So with that info, let’s group those choices again and see how they compete internally:
First group: T25 (comparison: https://www.lstreports.com/compare/vanderbilt/bu/gw/)
#18 Vanderbilt COA is $214,000.
#20 BU COA is $214,000.
#23 GW COA is $210,000.
These schools are all the same price, and of the three the hiring numbers at Vandy–as well as the national recognition–are highest. Vandy has the best biglaw placement and a much higher federal clerkship placement rate (and both are a reflection of name brand power). Other than geographical/city preferences (and Nashville is awesome), Vandy would be the clear choice of these three given costs are identical.
Second group: T75 (comparison: https://www.lstreports.com/compare/mary ... le/denver/)
#47 Maryland COA is $80,000.
#56 Temple COA is $60,000.
#74 Denver COA is $60,000.
Of those three, Temple has slightly better numbers than Maryland (likely due to Temple’s location in Philly), and both have better placement than Denver. I’d likely lean toward Temple since it’s $20K cheaper, but an argument can be made for Maryland too. I don’t see how Denver competes with Temple as far as employment.
So, if it were me, it’s Temple vs Vandy (https://www.lstreports.com/compare/vanderbilt/temple/), and what happens next depends entirely on your career aspirations. If it’s a biglaw career then Vandy is clearly superior and may well be worth the extra $150K. But if you prefer maximum lifetime flexibility–but without nearly the access to high-profile/high-paying jobs–then Temple could easily be safer for you. And it’s on the East Coast
However, right now you don’t seem too sure about what you want to do so you should really think on this since it’s a huge financial decision either way you go!I hope that helps, thanks!"