What are my chances? Options?

[Tiff_y]

Hello,

I am currently in my third-year undergraduate program in Canada, and I was wondering if I could get some advice, as my GPA is currently sitting at an anticipated 3.7 by the end of this school year. I plan to apply to law school this upcoming 2015 fall term. What are my options? I have reached out to counselling services at my university, but none have been exceptionally helpful. I am studying for my LSAT this summer. With my low GPA, what score should I reach (at LEAST) to have a shot at law school in Canada? Is it worth staying a 5th year to increase my GPA? Do law schools look at progressive improvement of GPA throughout the years in undergrad? I have had marks ranging from as low as 63 to 90+ (especially in my first year). How would law schools interpret this (does this harm my chance at acceptance)?

In addition, I went on an exchange for 1 semester in the UK, but their grading system is completely different. It ranges from a failing grade of 40 to Class I Division at 70. How do Canadian law schools convert my grades into Canadian grade standards, and how can I find out how? (Also, are law schools interested in my exchange experience)?

I have really been dedicating the last couple of years towards fighting for a chance at law school. I know that it is my dream and passion to study law, and I really do not want to waste any more time than I already have with where I stand now.

Thank you kindly,
Tiffany

[Nikki Siclunov]

Tiffany,

Thanks for your question. Most Canadian law programs require a minimum of 2 years of undergraduate studies, which you obviously have. I'm not sure why you believe 3.7 to be a low GPA, as the class average at McGill - arguably one of the best Canadian law schools - is 3.7 (https://www.mcgill.ca/law-admissions/un ... ssions/faq). Law schools typically do look at increases in one's GPA. Personally, I wouldn't spend another whole year in school just so I can bump up my GPA by a few decimal points: you're better off studying a bit harder for the LSAT, which will certainly not take a whole year. That said, if you have other reasons to stay in school, by all means do that.

Unfortunately, the GPA/LSAT calculator on lsac.org does not work with Canadian law schools; however, you can get a reasonably good idea of what numbers you need for each school by checking out their profiles here:

http://www.lsac.org/jd/choosing-a-law-s ... /key-facts

The best law schools seem to have median LSAT's in the 163-165 range, so this is probably the range you should be shooting for. Bear in mind, however, that Canadian law schools vary in the importance they place on the LSAT: some require it, while others do not. Some average the scores, others only take the highest score. There is a lot more variability among Canadian law schools than among U.S. law schools, so you are probably better off directing some of your questions to the specific law schools you're planning to apply to. Thankfully, there are only a dozen law schools to choose from, so this shouldn't be a terribly difficult task

Re: your studies in the U.K., again - Canadian schools do not follow LSAC protocol, so they probably differ in how they convert foreign transcripts into their system. Your best bet would be to contact the law schools directly, and ask about their policy regarding this matter.

Best of luck!

Thanks!

[Tiff_y]

Hi Nikki,

Thank you for your prompt response. It's been very helpful, but I should have clarified: my GPA is on the 'low-end' of 3.7 meaning it's currently sitting right at 80%. It's going to take an awful lot to boost up my GPA within the next year. That's where my concern is. I'm sure Law schools will look at the actual percentage, rather than just the GPA score itself.

Knowing that my GPA is lower than I made it out to be in my first post, does this perhaps change the advice you would give me? Considering that a 3.7 GPA can range anywhere from 80 to 84, which makes Law Admission statistics the more ambiguous, what are the chances of a low-80 GPA in getting an acceptance after graduation?

Thank you in advance,
Tiffany

[Nikki Siclunov]

Tiffany,

Unfortunately, Canadian schools do not use the LSAC's LSAT/GPA calculator, and so it would be impossible to provide specific admission probabilities. I still wouldn't stay in college for a whole year just so I can boost my GPA by a few percentage points, as I'm sure there are other factors - such as the LSAT - that would play a role in your chances. To me, it doesn't sound like there is a world of difference between 80 and 84, but you should probably contact the schools directly and inquire.

Good luck!

[nicolle828]

I am currently taking the online class with Ron on Tuesday nights. I am trying to choose what law schools to apply to. My GPA was 3.89, but I am an older student. Is it better to go to a top school and kill yourself and do really well or go to a good school and graduate at the top of my class?

[Nikki Siclunov]

Hi Nicole,

Thanks for your question. The fact that you're an older student only matters when considering the cost of attending law school: theoretically, the older you get, the higher the opportunity cost of attending. From that point of view, it makes the most sense to attend the best school you get into at the lowest possible cost. A lot of schools (even the top ones, with the exception of Harvard, Yale, and Stanford) give merit-based aid to applicants with high numbers; since your GPA is extraordinarily high, all you need is a similarly high LSAT score to make that happen!

Your question was somewhat puzzling in that it assumes attending a top law school would be unusually difficult or demanding. You also assume that by going to a lower-ranked school, you'll do better relative to your peers. Both assumptions are wrong. If you want to do well, law school will be challenging no matter where you go. Yes, top schools will have a lot of smart students, but they won't be any more competitive than the students attending lower-ranked schools. On the contrary: in an effort to discourage competition, the very top schools no longer have grades (all have Pass/Fail grading systems), and most Top-14 schools don't reveal your class rank. Furthermore, you can afford the luxury of not being at the very top of your class at T-14 schools, and still do well employment-wise.

What if you go to a lower-ranked school? Be prepared for a tougher fight. You - and everyone else there - knows they need to do exceptionally well to get a limited number of jobs, so placing in the top-10% of your class won't be a cakewalk. If your goal is to work at BIGLAW, most firms set different 1L grading requirements based on the reputation of the school they are recruiting at (top-50% at Penn Law vs. top-10% at Temple, for instance). Clerkships are similarly competitive, and federal clerkships are almost exclusively reserved for students at the top schools. Again, I don't know what you plan to do after graduation, but the more "prestigious" the job, the better off you are attending a top school.

Bottom line is, the best school to attend is the one that strikes the right balance between cost of attendance and employment opportunities, in a region where you'd like to practice (unless it's a top-14 school, in which case the region doesn't matter terribly much). Given your GPA, a high LSAT score will give you a lot to choose from! If I were you, I'd table this question for now until you take the LSAT, and see where you'd be competitive.

Good luck!

[nicolle828]

Dear Nikki,

Thank you for the quick reply! I recently also discussed this with Dave Killoran and he was helpful as well. I have decided to do as you suggested and not worry about it until after I take the test. I have just one follow up question......perfect scenario I get into Yale, Stanford and Duke (my top three choices not in any order).....all things being equal would it be better to go to a top three versus Duke or does that not matter in the job market? I am uncertain as to my plans post-law school as I will have all my children in college so I can make the decision just based on my desires....

Thanks again

Nicolle

[Nikki Siclunov]

Hi Nicole,

Thanks for the follow-up question. I'd say - wait and see where you get in, visit the schools, and decide then. All top-14 schools will give you outstanding opportunities after graduation; however, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are definitely a cut above the rest and I would attend one of these three schools, if given the choice.

I could make an exception if Duke gave me a full scholarship, especially if I were a non-traditional student for whom debt burden is a significant factor. That said, keep in mind that both Stanford and Yale have outstanding loan repayment programs, which basically foot the bill if you take (almost any) lower-paying job after graduation.

Again, this is a decision you won't have to make for another year