#5 - Everyone in Biba’s neighborhood is permitted to swim

[stsai]

The question is about Biba's neighborhood is permitted to swim at Barton Pool.
I selected (D) for it seemed most logical.
Could someone please explain why (B) is correct although it provides a S-->N relationship that seems odd to me?
Thanks!

[Nikki Siclunov]

The conditional relationships in the stimulus can be diagrammed as follows:

Live in Biba's neighborhood --> permitted to swim at some time during each day

Swim between 12-5 PM --> above the age of 6 only

Swim between 5 PM and closing --> adults only

So logically, if Biba's next-door neighbor (i.e. someone who lives in her neighborhood) has a child under the age of 6, and everyone in the neighborhood is permitted to swim at some time during the day, then the pool must be open before noon. Recall that after 12 PM, no children under the age of 6 are permitted to swim. So in the scenario described in answer choice (B), if the Barton Pool were not open before noon, the neighbor's child will be out of luck - which violates the conditional relationship in the first sentence.

[Jkjones3789]

Hello, In this Must be True question I totally see how the other four incorrect answers dont have to nec be true. But I also cannot see why B must be true. I understand that since everyone gets a chance to swim the children would be able to swim the only time they arent excluded which is before 12. But what does Biba's neighbor have to do with anything. I went C because B seemed weird to me. Please explain thank you !

[David Boyle]

Hello, In this Must be True question I totally see how the other four incorrect answers dont have to nec be true. But I also cannot see why B must be true. I understand that since everyone gets a chance to swim the children would be able to swim the only time they arent excluded which is before 12. But what does Biba's neighbor have to do with anything. I went C because B seemed weird to me. Please explain thank you !

Hello Jkjones3789,

B sounds very strange, you're right. But when you take all of "Everyone in Biba’s neighborhood is permitted to swim at Barton Pool at some time during each day that it is open. No children under the age of 6 are permitted to swim at Barton Pool between noon and 5 P.M. From 5 P.M. until closing, Barton Pool is reserved for adults only.": then, if someone's permitted to swim--as the stimulus says they are--, and is under 6, it can't be after 5 p.m., and can't be after noon. So, the pool must be open before noon.
But again, the phrasing of answer B is very strange!!! Wow.

Hope this helps,
David

[PeterC123]

Am I the only one who noticed this or am I looking too much into it. At the end of the first sentence it clearly said "during each day that it is open". Does this not mean that it has a chance that it would be closed?

So lets just say it closes on Thursdays for whatever reason, so what if the neighbour has a kid under 6, the pool is still closed. And so what if the kid is under 6, maybe the kid don't want to swim...

I definitely got that before 12 is when the kids under 6 can swim. If the answer said that if the pool is open and the kid under 6 wants to swim, then the pool is open before noon, then it would have been right.

I thought none of the answers were right.

[David Boyle]

Am I the only one who noticed this or am I looking too much into it. At the end of the first sentence it clearly said "during each day that it is open". Does this not mean that it has a chance that it would be closed?

So lets just say it closes on Thursdays for whatever reason, so what if the neighbour has a kid under 6, the pool is still closed. And so what if the kid is under 6, maybe the kid don't want to swim...

I definitely got that before 12 is when the kids under 6 can swim. If the answer said that if the pool is open and the kid under 6 wants to swim, then the pool is open before noon, then it would have been right.

I thought none of the answers were right.

Hello PeterC123.

Good eye, though maybe you are looking a little too much into it! Yes, the pool could be closed at times, for all we know. But sometimes Law Services does not close every single logical gap, and you have to answer the way that you think they would want you to answer.

Hope this helps,
David

[oli_oops]

Hello, In this Must be True question I totally see how the other four incorrect answers dont have to nec be true. But I also cannot see why B must be true. I understand that since everyone gets a chance to swim the children would be able to swim the only time they arent excluded which is before 12. But what does Biba's neighbor have to do with anything. I went C because B seemed weird to me. Please explain thank you !

Hello Jkjones3789,

B sounds very strange, you're right. But when you take all of "Everyone in Biba’s neighborhood is permitted to swim at Barton Pool at some time during each day that it is open. No children under the age of 6 are permitted to swim at Barton Pool between noon and 5 P.M. From 5 P.M. until closing, Barton Pool is reserved for adults only.": then, if someone's permitted to swim--as the stimulus says they are--, and is under 6, it can't be after 5 p.m., and can't be after noon. So, the pool must be open before noon.
But again, the phrasing of answer B is very strange!!! Wow.

Hope this helps,
David

Thank you for acknowledging B is weird! I didn't choose B because of that...
Though can you please explain why D isn't correct? Because I think it is.
B and D were my contenders.

Thank you!!

[Jay Donnell]

Hi oli_oops!

The specifics of the next-door neighbor's rugrat were a bit unexpected for sure, but it was just the idea that there was any person in the neighborhood under six that would have an impact on the pool's potential morning hours.


Though answer choice D uses the word some which is often a very attractive factor in a MBT answer, there is a pretty big conceptual shift that kicks D off of the potential winner list. The stimulus talked only of the schedule for accessibility to the pool, but we have no idea if anyone ever actually does swim. Being permitted to do something isn't equivalent to necessarily doing that thing.

Maybe the pool has been contaminated with toxic waste and no one wants to even dip their toes in the green sludge? Or perhaps the afternoon is when the pool employees release chlorine-tolerant killer sharks to swim their laps and its best to stay out of the water for a few hours... Obviously exaggerated examples, but it hopefully helps to show the difference between being permitted to swim and actually swimming.

We also know that children under six aren't permitted to swim between noon and 5pm, which I would have to think covers the whole range of the afternoon. That means this answer is also dubious in that it limits any potential children swimmers to those between six and whatever is decided as the highest range for childhood.

In summary: it's good to lean into answers with weak logical force (some, may, could, might, possible, etc), but we have to be extremely careful to watch for equivocations between concepts that make even weak statements unable to be proven true.

I hope that helps!

[oli_oops]

Hi oli_oops!

The specifics of the next-door neighbor's rugrat were a bit unexpected for sure, but it was just the idea that there was any person in the neighborhood under six that would have an impact on the pool's potential morning hours.


Though answer choice D uses the word some which is often a very attractive factor in a MBT answer, there is a pretty big conceptual shift that kicks D off of the potential winner list. The stimulus talked only of the schedule for accessibility to the pool, but we have no idea if anyone ever actually does swim. Being permitted to do something isn't equivalent to necessarily doing that thing.

Maybe the pool has been contaminated with toxic waste and no one wants to even dip their toes in the green sludge? Or perhaps the afternoon is when the pool employees release chlorine-tolerant killer sharks to swim their laps and its best to stay out of the water for a few hours... Obviously exaggerated examples, but it hopefully helps to show the difference between being permitted to swim and actually swimming.

We also know that children under six aren't permitted to swim between noon and 5pm, which I would have to think covers the whole range of the afternoon. That means this answer is also dubious in that it limits any potential children swimmers to those between six and whatever is decided as the highest range for childhood.

In summary: it's good to lean into answers with weak logical force (some, may, could, might, possible, etc), but we have to be extremely careful to watch for equivocations between concepts that make even weak statements unable to be proven true.

I hope that helps!

Hi, this is really helpful, thank you!!

[Jay Donnell]

You're so welcome, keep up the good work and keep those great questions coming!